Lesser Evets
Apr 30, 02:01 PM
yes, new imac's will come, but sadly the will probably come without:
1- Matte screen option (Isn't there an aftermarket for this?)
2- USB 3 (Nah)
3- Blu-Ray (Not a chance: BluRay is in a body bag waiting to be zipped in about 3 or 4 years)
1- Matte screen option (Isn't there an aftermarket for this?)
2- USB 3 (Nah)
3- Blu-Ray (Not a chance: BluRay is in a body bag waiting to be zipped in about 3 or 4 years)
Nomadski
Apr 13, 07:07 AM
MagnusVonMagnum -
- Sonos is not "way better quality" (AppleTV2 output is DIGITAL and so the "quality" depends entirely on the stereo you connect it to. So sorry but you have no point there.
Unless you've purchased / converted music in Apple lossless format it IS way better quality. Im making the comparison of my situation listening to FLAC vs the masses who purchase mp3s on iTunes. You could rip your music in Apple Lossless for sure, but then your hooked into iTunes, cant play on WMP or most other mp3s other than iPods. Like with a lot of stuff iTunes related, if you go that route, your stuck. Even the all inclusive Sonos S5 sounds better than the best iPod dock on the market (Bose 10 / Zeppelin whichever grabs your boat the most).
- It may not be better quality, but it IS "way more expensive". AppleTV2 costs $99 (same price as an Airport Express which is "audio only" like Sonos). Sonos OTOH costs $349 for a basic receiver which then still requires to either be connected directly to a router (wired) OR you have to pay ANOTHER $99 for a "bridge" to send a separate wireless signal off your router just for Sonos devices (waste of bandwidth and clutters the band with more wireless signals instead of just using your existing wireless router, which most people already have (how many used a wired only router and if you did you cannot use the Sonos wireless for anything else). So already you are at LEAST $450 in the hole for a single room with Sonos and you have ONLY AUDIO capability.
Sonos isnt cheap for sure, but that is why I said people who have no shortage of money at the start of my thread. Some people have massive Mac systems, those people shouldn't skimp when it comes to music, if they like music, or video for that matter.
One of the big features of Sonos which you obviously arent aware of is that Sonos DOESNT hog your bandwidth. It uses its own Mesh network which works independantly of your home wireless network, hence no bandwidth constraints, which is why you can have up to 32 Sonos units all working AT THE SAME TIME on the same or different sources whilst not affecting the bandwidth capability of your home network. Try using even 2 AppleTV2s at the same time and see how much of your bandwidth is left.
Also, if you live in a large house, or one with thick walls, or you want to listen outside, because Sonos recreates its own Mesh network each time it hits a Sonos unit strength signal on the opposite side of the house to the router is still very high, each Zone Player acts like a new Sonos signal source.
Yup its expensive but I bought my first Sonos bit of kit in 2006. Since then ive added 3 more units, 2 of which were new redesigned units released a couple of years ago. Ive also added a second controller when they moved to touchscreen 2 years ago. And you know what? It all works seamlessly with each other. Old hardware, new hardware, built up over time. New features added over time (for free) seamlessly updated into even the oldest bit of hardware with a firmware update, they even added full Touch, iPhone and iPad control options so I could use any of them to control the audio around the house. Can you integrate AppleTV2 with 1? Can you honestly say in 5 years time your money spent will still work with the rest of your AppleTV system as they upgrade and add new features? When 3 year old sounddocks wont even charge new ipods I would hazard a guess...no.
-But then I would be forgetting you need a SOURCE of music. You tout the use of an NAS, but most NAS devices aren't exactly cheap or anything. For all intensive purposes they are a just a headless computer and most run Linux. AppleTV2 is out of the box a PITA if you don't want to leave a computer on, but you can put XBMC on it which will use any NAS or networked source. You then have the same functionality as Sonos BUT you also have full video capability. You could instead get a cheap Netbook for $250 (cheaper than most NAS devices) and connect a hard drive to that and run iTunes and the full Apple interface if you'd like and still have XBMC available as well. Personally, I just use an old PPC G4 PowerMac as a server and 24/7 Internet terminal. Intel machines can also be set to Wake On Lan, so you can have your machine sleep while AppleTV is not in use. In short, NAS isn't as great as you make it sound (most are also dog slow compared to a real computer) and there are alternative options even with Apple software like a cheap Netbook as a server.
NAS or WHS arent cheap but youve just contradicted yourself.
Sonos will also play from any networked PC, MAC, External hard drive on Airport, netbook. To use a NAS you dont have to install XBMC on it, it works out of the box from any source you want. That PPC G4 would also work with Sonos, or you could play Last.FM, or Pandora, or Spotify, or Napster, or unlimited internet radio (you can even add your own internet radio addresses).
Best of all, you DONT have to use iTunes. You can if you want, but you dont have to.
Sonos also gives you multi room grouping. Group 2 or more zones together and enjoy synced music wherever you want it. Not miliseconds out syncing like Sony or Logitech but 100% synced. Dropping zones can be done at the flick of the controller.
Read a review of a new album in the newspaper? Listen to it 5 seconds later on Sonos.
So the kids can listen to their own music streamed in their rooms upstairs, my wife can be listening to the TV, or some music in the living room, and I can be in my little den listening to my music whilst enjoying near full speed wireless capability on my pc or mac, or maybe my wife likes a song shes hearing upstairs and links zones so she can hear it downstairs.
You can buy a standalone unit which sounds better than the B&W Zeppelin, or get the amped unit for attaching to any speaker system you want, or get the small unit for use (as you do) with your existing stereo system. You can add these anytime you want, building up your Sonos system over time, without the fear it will be redundant over time.
Its a high end multi room music system vs a limited single streaming unit.
-Now I come to the heart of the matter...VIDEO. You suggest a Popcorn Hour in ADDITION to the already out of this world priced Sonos system. They start at $179 and go up to $299. That brings your total minimum price for a wireless system for a single room to $629 AND you have to switch between two separate devices to listen to audio and/or watch videos. With AppleTV you have all your movies, tv shows, photos, music, music videos, YouTube and Internet Radio (plus the options of XBMC with a quick hack including non-Apple formats) and your TOTAL COST for **one** room wireless using an existing wireless router is $99. $629 versus $99...Hmmmmmm. And then there's the matter of Popcorn Hour's crappy interface versus Apple's polished one. XBMC makes Popcorn Hour look bad as well. Bugs or popcorn? :confused:
Cost seems to be the big issue with you, so I wonder if you own a mac mini as opposed to 3 macbook pros, an imac, apple tv2 etc etc as many posters here have? If so, Sonos etc wont be for you. If you do own multiple Apple systems why are you so concerned with price? If you want the best you got to pay for it.
With Apple TV you DONT have all your movies or music or internet radio. you have limited experiences with all 3. No 1080p, no DVD images (Popcorn will load your dvd image in exactly the same way your dvd player would), wont play .mp4 .m4v .mkv .wmv .avi .aac .divx, doesnt have full support for all subtitle formats, wont play FLAC or anything else outside of your iTunes library audio wise and its internet radio function is gimped.
Its sure nice to have it in one box, but *it* is very very limited. Dedicated systems will always trump jack of all trade systems.
The interface is nice on AppleTV2 for sure, my popcorn looks better though with my skin on it. The default layout looks boring ill agree.
So for the price of your ONE room audio and video, I could have SIX rooms using AppleTV2 with both video and audio and still have $29 to spare
Except you couldnt do that could you? Your wireless network would be crippled with half that many running at the same time. I can assure you I can play a 1080P movie AND have 3 other Sonos units streaming at the same time. Try that sometime with 4 AppleTVs...
With XBMC installed, it can play any format (just like Popcorn Hour).
No, no it cant. DVD isos? All subtitle formats? 1080P? Also your slightly expanded feature set (not out of the box) is achieved by essentially hacking your AppleTV 2, so good luck on the next firmware update.
Hell, I can even buy a cheap 3.5" internal hard drive and slot that into my popcorn hour if I want to store the films locally, what sized hard drive does Apple TV2 have? Oh wait.
Your not seeing the advantages with zero configuration audio system, and a play all with no hassles video system? The only mucking about in my system is if you want a nice shinier interface with Popcorn Hour. You have to convert audio, replace (essentially) the OS to XBMC, have a linux system and a Crystal card to play 1080p on an OLDER Apple TV (your not factoring in this stuff with your price or integrated system arguments are you?) and you STILL have a far more limited setup.
Reading thru your post I guarantee you your costs are higher than $99 and in about 2 years time your system will be redundant.
Im not saying the AppleTV 2 is useless for everyone, for many of the dumb masses who are locked into iTunes already its probably the best thing since sliced bread, and really its only advantage is a cheap price and movie rentals, in glorious 720P, but if I want to feed my 42" 1080p plasma with subpar 720P video I could use the xbox or PS3 sitting under the TV, which I also dont bother with. For audiophiles or moviephiles it doesn't cut it.
- Sonos is not "way better quality" (AppleTV2 output is DIGITAL and so the "quality" depends entirely on the stereo you connect it to. So sorry but you have no point there.
Unless you've purchased / converted music in Apple lossless format it IS way better quality. Im making the comparison of my situation listening to FLAC vs the masses who purchase mp3s on iTunes. You could rip your music in Apple Lossless for sure, but then your hooked into iTunes, cant play on WMP or most other mp3s other than iPods. Like with a lot of stuff iTunes related, if you go that route, your stuck. Even the all inclusive Sonos S5 sounds better than the best iPod dock on the market (Bose 10 / Zeppelin whichever grabs your boat the most).
- It may not be better quality, but it IS "way more expensive". AppleTV2 costs $99 (same price as an Airport Express which is "audio only" like Sonos). Sonos OTOH costs $349 for a basic receiver which then still requires to either be connected directly to a router (wired) OR you have to pay ANOTHER $99 for a "bridge" to send a separate wireless signal off your router just for Sonos devices (waste of bandwidth and clutters the band with more wireless signals instead of just using your existing wireless router, which most people already have (how many used a wired only router and if you did you cannot use the Sonos wireless for anything else). So already you are at LEAST $450 in the hole for a single room with Sonos and you have ONLY AUDIO capability.
Sonos isnt cheap for sure, but that is why I said people who have no shortage of money at the start of my thread. Some people have massive Mac systems, those people shouldn't skimp when it comes to music, if they like music, or video for that matter.
One of the big features of Sonos which you obviously arent aware of is that Sonos DOESNT hog your bandwidth. It uses its own Mesh network which works independantly of your home wireless network, hence no bandwidth constraints, which is why you can have up to 32 Sonos units all working AT THE SAME TIME on the same or different sources whilst not affecting the bandwidth capability of your home network. Try using even 2 AppleTV2s at the same time and see how much of your bandwidth is left.
Also, if you live in a large house, or one with thick walls, or you want to listen outside, because Sonos recreates its own Mesh network each time it hits a Sonos unit strength signal on the opposite side of the house to the router is still very high, each Zone Player acts like a new Sonos signal source.
Yup its expensive but I bought my first Sonos bit of kit in 2006. Since then ive added 3 more units, 2 of which were new redesigned units released a couple of years ago. Ive also added a second controller when they moved to touchscreen 2 years ago. And you know what? It all works seamlessly with each other. Old hardware, new hardware, built up over time. New features added over time (for free) seamlessly updated into even the oldest bit of hardware with a firmware update, they even added full Touch, iPhone and iPad control options so I could use any of them to control the audio around the house. Can you integrate AppleTV2 with 1? Can you honestly say in 5 years time your money spent will still work with the rest of your AppleTV system as they upgrade and add new features? When 3 year old sounddocks wont even charge new ipods I would hazard a guess...no.
-But then I would be forgetting you need a SOURCE of music. You tout the use of an NAS, but most NAS devices aren't exactly cheap or anything. For all intensive purposes they are a just a headless computer and most run Linux. AppleTV2 is out of the box a PITA if you don't want to leave a computer on, but you can put XBMC on it which will use any NAS or networked source. You then have the same functionality as Sonos BUT you also have full video capability. You could instead get a cheap Netbook for $250 (cheaper than most NAS devices) and connect a hard drive to that and run iTunes and the full Apple interface if you'd like and still have XBMC available as well. Personally, I just use an old PPC G4 PowerMac as a server and 24/7 Internet terminal. Intel machines can also be set to Wake On Lan, so you can have your machine sleep while AppleTV is not in use. In short, NAS isn't as great as you make it sound (most are also dog slow compared to a real computer) and there are alternative options even with Apple software like a cheap Netbook as a server.
NAS or WHS arent cheap but youve just contradicted yourself.
Sonos will also play from any networked PC, MAC, External hard drive on Airport, netbook. To use a NAS you dont have to install XBMC on it, it works out of the box from any source you want. That PPC G4 would also work with Sonos, or you could play Last.FM, or Pandora, or Spotify, or Napster, or unlimited internet radio (you can even add your own internet radio addresses).
Best of all, you DONT have to use iTunes. You can if you want, but you dont have to.
Sonos also gives you multi room grouping. Group 2 or more zones together and enjoy synced music wherever you want it. Not miliseconds out syncing like Sony or Logitech but 100% synced. Dropping zones can be done at the flick of the controller.
Read a review of a new album in the newspaper? Listen to it 5 seconds later on Sonos.
So the kids can listen to their own music streamed in their rooms upstairs, my wife can be listening to the TV, or some music in the living room, and I can be in my little den listening to my music whilst enjoying near full speed wireless capability on my pc or mac, or maybe my wife likes a song shes hearing upstairs and links zones so she can hear it downstairs.
You can buy a standalone unit which sounds better than the B&W Zeppelin, or get the amped unit for attaching to any speaker system you want, or get the small unit for use (as you do) with your existing stereo system. You can add these anytime you want, building up your Sonos system over time, without the fear it will be redundant over time.
Its a high end multi room music system vs a limited single streaming unit.
-Now I come to the heart of the matter...VIDEO. You suggest a Popcorn Hour in ADDITION to the already out of this world priced Sonos system. They start at $179 and go up to $299. That brings your total minimum price for a wireless system for a single room to $629 AND you have to switch between two separate devices to listen to audio and/or watch videos. With AppleTV you have all your movies, tv shows, photos, music, music videos, YouTube and Internet Radio (plus the options of XBMC with a quick hack including non-Apple formats) and your TOTAL COST for **one** room wireless using an existing wireless router is $99. $629 versus $99...Hmmmmmm. And then there's the matter of Popcorn Hour's crappy interface versus Apple's polished one. XBMC makes Popcorn Hour look bad as well. Bugs or popcorn? :confused:
Cost seems to be the big issue with you, so I wonder if you own a mac mini as opposed to 3 macbook pros, an imac, apple tv2 etc etc as many posters here have? If so, Sonos etc wont be for you. If you do own multiple Apple systems why are you so concerned with price? If you want the best you got to pay for it.
With Apple TV you DONT have all your movies or music or internet radio. you have limited experiences with all 3. No 1080p, no DVD images (Popcorn will load your dvd image in exactly the same way your dvd player would), wont play .mp4 .m4v .mkv .wmv .avi .aac .divx, doesnt have full support for all subtitle formats, wont play FLAC or anything else outside of your iTunes library audio wise and its internet radio function is gimped.
Its sure nice to have it in one box, but *it* is very very limited. Dedicated systems will always trump jack of all trade systems.
The interface is nice on AppleTV2 for sure, my popcorn looks better though with my skin on it. The default layout looks boring ill agree.
So for the price of your ONE room audio and video, I could have SIX rooms using AppleTV2 with both video and audio and still have $29 to spare
Except you couldnt do that could you? Your wireless network would be crippled with half that many running at the same time. I can assure you I can play a 1080P movie AND have 3 other Sonos units streaming at the same time. Try that sometime with 4 AppleTVs...
With XBMC installed, it can play any format (just like Popcorn Hour).
No, no it cant. DVD isos? All subtitle formats? 1080P? Also your slightly expanded feature set (not out of the box) is achieved by essentially hacking your AppleTV 2, so good luck on the next firmware update.
Hell, I can even buy a cheap 3.5" internal hard drive and slot that into my popcorn hour if I want to store the films locally, what sized hard drive does Apple TV2 have? Oh wait.
Your not seeing the advantages with zero configuration audio system, and a play all with no hassles video system? The only mucking about in my system is if you want a nice shinier interface with Popcorn Hour. You have to convert audio, replace (essentially) the OS to XBMC, have a linux system and a Crystal card to play 1080p on an OLDER Apple TV (your not factoring in this stuff with your price or integrated system arguments are you?) and you STILL have a far more limited setup.
Reading thru your post I guarantee you your costs are higher than $99 and in about 2 years time your system will be redundant.
Im not saying the AppleTV 2 is useless for everyone, for many of the dumb masses who are locked into iTunes already its probably the best thing since sliced bread, and really its only advantage is a cheap price and movie rentals, in glorious 720P, but if I want to feed my 42" 1080p plasma with subpar 720P video I could use the xbox or PS3 sitting under the TV, which I also dont bother with. For audiophiles or moviephiles it doesn't cut it.
tpavur
Apr 4, 12:07 PM
"So Live and Let Die!"
You shoot their leg, they shoot you in the head.
Anyone who points a gun at another person is asking for trouble, even if he/she doesn't fire it.
If guns didn't exist, things like this wouldn't be happening.
If guns did not exist it would be happening with whatever does. swords, rocks, fists... in which case the mall cop would have probably been killed in this situation and lost the "good fight". It becomes a game of numbers when guns do not exist... all guns do is put everybody on a level playing field regarldess of numbers (be realistic) or physical strength.
You shoot their leg, they shoot you in the head.
Anyone who points a gun at another person is asking for trouble, even if he/she doesn't fire it.
If guns didn't exist, things like this wouldn't be happening.
If guns did not exist it would be happening with whatever does. swords, rocks, fists... in which case the mall cop would have probably been killed in this situation and lost the "good fight". It becomes a game of numbers when guns do not exist... all guns do is put everybody on a level playing field regarldess of numbers (be realistic) or physical strength.
appleguy
Sep 4, 08:35 PM
Stick to the cables, you need 802.11n minimum to do this and it will kill your home network. Nobody else at home can do anything else.
Well if its your network. screw everyone else I say. lol:cool:
Well if its your network. screw everyone else I say. lol:cool:
Peace
Aug 28, 02:47 PM
Man you guys have some smart cats.All mine ever says is feed me and let me outside.
I DO have a little bird that talks a lot though.He says new iMacs with Conroe.Movie services and TIVO to be announced on or around the IBC convention Sept 8th
http://www.ibc.org/cgi-bin/displaypage.cgi?pageref=100
Which by the way Apple is attending and is listed in these catagories :
Computers
DV Editing Systems
DVD Authoring equipment
Editing - Video
HDTV
Internet
Multi Media
Non Linear Video Editing
PC, Internet and multimedia
Software
;)
I DO have a little bird that talks a lot though.He says new iMacs with Conroe.Movie services and TIVO to be announced on or around the IBC convention Sept 8th
http://www.ibc.org/cgi-bin/displaypage.cgi?pageref=100
Which by the way Apple is attending and is listed in these catagories :
Computers
DV Editing Systems
DVD Authoring equipment
Editing - Video
HDTV
Internet
Multi Media
Non Linear Video Editing
PC, Internet and multimedia
Software
;)
iScott428
Mar 23, 05:43 PM
So much for freedom. Leave it Apple!
bchreng
May 1, 01:23 AM
Curious that everyone is clamoring for a thunderbolt-enabled machine, but there isn't a single thunderbolt drive available on the market.
I guess some people just need to feel like they have new stuff even if it's totally pointless.
Some people - like me - may not own a mac desktop yet and would like to purchase one soon and intend on using it for quite a while. So while there may be no devices at the moment, there could very well be such a device released next year or the year after. When it is released we'll be glad that our iMacs have the port. It's not exactly like a pc where we can open up the case and add in the port later on.
I guess some people just need to feel like they have new stuff even if it's totally pointless.
Some people - like me - may not own a mac desktop yet and would like to purchase one soon and intend on using it for quite a while. So while there may be no devices at the moment, there could very well be such a device released next year or the year after. When it is released we'll be glad that our iMacs have the port. It's not exactly like a pc where we can open up the case and add in the port later on.
kettle
Oct 27, 02:04 PM
Yeah, but what is currently out there that's better?
That's an empty question that just defends what's going on as "don't worry, it'll be all right" when what people are really too frightened to ask is how long will this go on and what opposing force will be needed to make it change direction. Things are getting worse and lately it's hard to ignore the smell.
That's an empty question that just defends what's going on as "don't worry, it'll be all right" when what people are really too frightened to ask is how long will this go on and what opposing force will be needed to make it change direction. Things are getting worse and lately it's hard to ignore the smell.
rxse7en
Jul 14, 11:14 AM
I am glad you have enough knowledge to tell me why it is silly, instead of making a silly comment yourself.
What's up with the personal insults? If you want to pay top dollar for incremental increases that's your choice. Most of us "professionals" would prefer the fastest systems available, because as we all know, time is money!
What's up with the personal insults? If you want to pay top dollar for incremental increases that's your choice. Most of us "professionals" would prefer the fastest systems available, because as we all know, time is money!
djrobsd
Apr 11, 03:29 PM
AMAZING!!!!!!
I'm very excited to see this come to XBMC. Cannot wait!
I'm confused... What will this give us in XBMC that we don't already have? Since I'm assuming you're running XBMC on Apple TV2, Airplay already works just fine...
From my iTunes library on my PC I can stream to my Apple TV2 in the bedroom, or to my Airport Express in the living room. From my iPhone, I can stream almost any app (Napster, Pandora, Netflix, etc) to either my AppleTV2 or the living room Airport express (audio only).
So, I'm confused what additional capability this is going to give those of us who have already invested in an Apple ecosystem.
I'm very excited to see this come to XBMC. Cannot wait!
I'm confused... What will this give us in XBMC that we don't already have? Since I'm assuming you're running XBMC on Apple TV2, Airplay already works just fine...
From my iTunes library on my PC I can stream to my Apple TV2 in the bedroom, or to my Airport Express in the living room. From my iPhone, I can stream almost any app (Napster, Pandora, Netflix, etc) to either my AppleTV2 or the living room Airport express (audio only).
So, I'm confused what additional capability this is going to give those of us who have already invested in an Apple ecosystem.
CQd44
Apr 16, 10:26 PM
It's something I observed as well. It's an entertaining phenomenon
Specs only matter if you have them.
My laptop has USB3, but until I get a USB3 flash drive I don't think it'll ever be used to its fullest. :(
Specs only matter if you have them.
My laptop has USB3, but until I get a USB3 flash drive I don't think it'll ever be used to its fullest. :(
TheKrillr
Aug 28, 04:14 PM
this goes to show how behind apple is in updating.
clearly they arent ready to adapt to an intel platform. the cant even make simple processor adjustments on time!
all the major companies have made this transition.
apple needs to stop being so secretive. they need to start acting like a real computer company, and let there customers know when upgrades are coming.
i wouldnt be surprised if we didnt see these upgrades till october.. no.. january.
this is ridiculous.
/end rant
On time? The other companies just announced, and are not actually shipping. Give apple time, I'm sure they'll be shipping before the others. :-)
clearly they arent ready to adapt to an intel platform. the cant even make simple processor adjustments on time!
all the major companies have made this transition.
apple needs to stop being so secretive. they need to start acting like a real computer company, and let there customers know when upgrades are coming.
i wouldnt be surprised if we didnt see these upgrades till october.. no.. january.
this is ridiculous.
/end rant
On time? The other companies just announced, and are not actually shipping. Give apple time, I'm sure they'll be shipping before the others. :-)
Hattig
Mar 29, 12:50 PM
Have I just done the impossible? :D
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/5492/excels.th.png (http://img215.imageshack.us/i/excels.png/) http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/8916/wordc.th.png (http://img140.imageshack.us/i/wordc.png/)
I think he was referring to the older versions of Office that had weird MDI interfaces for Word and Excel, so that it only displayed one document at a time, unless you explicitly forced two separate instances of the application to run at the same time.
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/5492/excels.th.png (http://img215.imageshack.us/i/excels.png/) http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/8916/wordc.th.png (http://img140.imageshack.us/i/wordc.png/)
I think he was referring to the older versions of Office that had weird MDI interfaces for Word and Excel, so that it only displayed one document at a time, unless you explicitly forced two separate instances of the application to run at the same time.
Some_Big_Spoon
Sep 11, 12:10 AM
I hear that again and again, but I just can't believe it.. was it just him? How could someone so far ahead drop the ball like that? I know, Palm and BeOS...
Macnealy's ego got in the way....
Macnealy's ego got in the way....
JobsRules
Oct 27, 12:20 PM
Somebody please explain to me what GW Bush has to do with a Greenpeace story out of the London Mac Expo?
I'd guess because we now live in an era, often associated with the Bush era, where crushing all dissent is considered no biggie by a large section of the fear-controlled, TV-addled masses?
Therefore any heavy handed, over the top, removal of protestors or dissenters is therefore viewed in relation to the current climate.
Nothing wierd about that - historians talk about 'Victorian values' to denote a wide collection of social and political mores. People see the politics of fear, of removal of long-held liberties, planting fake new stories in the press, shouting down or restricting of dissent to be the defining characteristics of the 'Bush era'.
I'd guess because we now live in an era, often associated with the Bush era, where crushing all dissent is considered no biggie by a large section of the fear-controlled, TV-addled masses?
Therefore any heavy handed, over the top, removal of protestors or dissenters is therefore viewed in relation to the current climate.
Nothing wierd about that - historians talk about 'Victorian values' to denote a wide collection of social and political mores. People see the politics of fear, of removal of long-held liberties, planting fake new stories in the press, shouting down or restricting of dissent to be the defining characteristics of the 'Bush era'.
sushi
Sep 13, 03:10 AM
did anyone notice how he called MahJong "May-Hong"?
Yep. Got a little chuckle out of that. Fun game.
Yep. Got a little chuckle out of that. Fun game.
macman2790
Sep 5, 01:21 PM
I'm really hoping for merom in mbp's and mb's. The wait has been killing me.
Derekasaurus
Jul 14, 09:19 AM
Bring 'em on, but place them in a mid-tower case.
Or a mini. ;-)
Or a mini. ;-)
pavetheforest
Sep 15, 10:01 PM
I would ditch my verizon plan the instant it came out...
Renverse
Apr 17, 01:05 PM
McAfee is irrelevant, even for Windows users. They call themselves experts but their software just brings ANY computer to a grinding halt.
Anyone remember this: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-20003074-83.html ?
Yeah.
Anyone remember this: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-20003074-83.html ?
Yeah.
Blakeco123
Mar 23, 05:49 PM
Do it apple!!!
I agree with you. if someone is drunk and is still able to operate the app they could be a hazard if they avoid these points.
I agree with you. if someone is drunk and is still able to operate the app they could be a hazard if they avoid these points.
BWhaler
Sep 4, 11:39 PM
This seems contradictory.
10 bucks, but it only streams?
Maybe I am missing something, or maybe this is just pieces of the puzzle.
10 bucks, but it only streams?
Maybe I am missing something, or maybe this is just pieces of the puzzle.
ngenerator
Mar 23, 05:03 PM
Boo! What's the point of drinking and driving if I can't also be distracted by my bright and pretty iPhone? Goddamn senators
aricher
Oct 12, 12:58 PM
Oh Bono...
http://www.u2station.com/images/images/oprah_06.jpg
I hope he sterilized that cheek with a blowtorch after the show. Whatever, at least he's a whore for good causes.
http://www.u2station.com/images/images/oprah_06.jpg
I hope he sterilized that cheek with a blowtorch after the show. Whatever, at least he's a whore for good causes.